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30/01/2010 4:03:56 PM
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Matt Sarre
Posts 8
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Like many of you, hill climbing is what lights my fire in the saddle. I noticed while riding with various groups around TDU that there's a lot of variation in climbing technique out there. When to stay seated. When to 'stand'. What position you 'stand' in.
It got me thinking about the art vs sceience of climbing technique and I'd love to hear how others sort if out.
Do you have speed/gradient triggers to stand or do you just go with the feel of the moment?
Do you have technique tips on standing position (and seated position I guess?)
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30/01/2010 10:13:34 PM
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Aaron Griffiths
Posts 6
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Matt
I asked the same question, and I was told by the bike-fitting guy at Cycle Worx (thanx Andy!) that it is best to be seated on a long climb with a stable gradient, since you can focus on your pedalling technique. He said you can keep the out-of-saddle efforts for shorter bursts (change in gradient, attacks if racing, stretch the legs etc), but then get back into the seated position when this burst has finished. This advice surprised me a bit, but there ya go.......it sounds a bit like "slow and steady wins the race".
As far as what position for out-of-saddle climbs, I've got no idea. It may be what suits the individual, as long as the pedalling technique is maintained.
AG
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1/02/2010 12:36:42 AM
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Michael Warner
Posts 116
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Climbing out of the saddle is certainly less efficient - apparently you need about 10% more energy to maintain your speed. So in theory staying seated the whole way would get you up there most quickly, but standing for 15-30 seconds or so every few minutes gives a perceived "stretch" by changing the load on your muscles and gives you a mental break. It makes climbing a little slower, but more enjoyable.
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2/02/2010 1:02:01 PM
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Aaron Griffiths
Posts 6
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Matt
See attached. I won't charge for the research
AG
Attachments:
MB Coaching Hills.pdf
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2/02/2010 4:25:56 PM
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Peter Teichert
Posts 2
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Hey Aaron,
Thanks for posting this, very interesting.
PT
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2/02/2010 6:02:12 PM
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Robert Rau
Posts 141
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Improvement for me happened when Les Mills RPM released the "power climb" position which involves remaining seated and powering through using gluteal and hip flexors to maintain a maximum effort through the pedals. It is a bit rough on the knees and I wont recommend accelerating while in this position. It is interesting to watch old cycling videos (on youtube) of Pantani climbing and accelerating in a stanging position....he spent 70-80 percent of his time on the pegs, but Lance on the same climb would be climbing 70-80 percent of the time in the saddle. Probably another tip would be is to remain relaxed as possible and climb smoothly which seems to be a consistent recommendation from all the tips I have heard, for example Pat Jonker. (Love his idea that if you cant find a hill close enough to climb or train on, then ride into a head wind). I think you will eventually find your own style to suit you the more you climb
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3/02/2010 10:18:22 AM
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Paul A Smith
Posts 16
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I remember climbing up Checkers Hill Road (the one and only time) and I thought if I stand up I'm going to fall over.
Normally I would climb seated using a high cadence and stand to give my back and legs a stretch.
When I do want to accelerate its much like the article stated... click down a gear or two and get up out of the saddle.
Mind you, I'm not the fastest uphill by a long shot.
From memory, I don't think Jack Bobridge got out of the saddle during his Norton Summit record.
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3/02/2010 7:08:46 PM
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JDL
Posts 47
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Paul A Smith wrote:
I remember climbing up Checkers Hill Road (the one and only time) and I thought if I stand up I'm going to fall over.
Normally I would climb seated using a high cadence and stand to give my back and legs a stretch.
When I do want to accelerate its much like the article stated... click down a gear or two and get up out of the saddle.
Mind you, I'm not the fastest uphill by a long shot.
From memory, I don't think Jack Bobridge got out of the saddle during his Norton Summit record.
Firstly I'm sure you're not the only person who thought they were going to fall over on Checker!
Secondly I think you misread the article, the normal approach is to click up a gear or two when you get out of the saddle (apologies if you meant down as in down the cassette to a smaller cog), to a higher ratio, and this is what the article states as well..
Thirdly, I imagine the fastest way up Norton Summit would be seated all the way as you suggested.. It's not steep enough to really require getting out of the saddle I wouldn't have thought... However just because seated may be faster, doesn't mean it's as comfortable/enjoyable as getting out of the saddle occassionally.. I doubt Jack was worried too much about comfort or enjoyment when he set that time!
edited by JDL on 3/02/2010
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3/02/2010 8:43:30 PM
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Nick Muir
Posts 17
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I read an article about a year ago that said new research had proved that above a certain gradient ( can't recall , but it might have been 8% ) it is in fact equally efficient standing or sitting . They monitored HR , oxygen consumption & power output & they all remained about the same either sitting or standing on very steep gradients. I can't verify this so though unfortunatly.
From a personal point of view i always find i tend to pull away from another rider on a long climb if i stand up without a perceived increase in effort ... i guess if one set of muscles is fatigued then it pays to use some different ones despite the fact that it is often less efficient .
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3/02/2010 9:05:05 PM
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The Mountain Goat
Posts 6
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Guys,
I like to think of myself as a half decent climber despite my less then perfect fitness so I might have something to add.
On Norton summit for example I try to stay seated untill the last of 3 left hand switch backs. I find its steep enough there to get a worthwile boost by standing up.
My theory is that unless the gradient moves up to say 6 or 7 percent then the maximum gain by standing up is less than the amount of energy used.
On Willunga hill for example I go up and down constantly because I feel that the difference between effort used being up or down is reduced.
I must admit though, in to that wind on the way to Goolwa I was standing up to stretch my legs.
But Iam only a hack
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4/02/2010 1:02:22 AM
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Paul Inglis
Posts 1
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I tend to be standing for a lot of the climbing I do, but that does also depend on which climb. Norton Summit is almost all seated except for a few ramps after the hairpins, whereas Greenhill Rd I tend to quicker times when I stand most of the time. Either way it's just all about keeping a good sustainable rhythm. Usually when I'm swapping between the two constantly I won't put in a good time.
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7/02/2010 12:56:55 PM
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Neil Smith
Posts 1
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there is a topic here that kind of talks about it
http://blog.cyclekrazy.com/2009/06/climbing-techniques-become-a-better-climber/
more interesting was this one
http://blog.cyclekrazy.com/2009/09/climbing-power-vs-flat-power/
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pages:
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